Sociologist turned soap opera writer turned business mogul, Phil Redmond talks to Lisa Miles about entrepreneurs, the TV industry and the history of social intervention
For a closet Hollyoaks fan and someone brought up on Grange Hill, interviewing Phil Redmond for a business magazine is a tough gig. Surely we should be discussing how good old Tucker's luck ran out or why young, blond, toned people from somewhere in the vicinity of Chester lead such unusually challenging lives.But one-time social studies student Redmond is more than a man who can craft good, yet educational, drama out of contemporary social issues. Here is an entrepreneur who commands the respect of his peers and bends the ear of the public sector.
In 1981 he set up Mersey Television, taking power - and money - away from the London production companies and building what is still Britain's biggest permanent employer in the independent production sector, with around 500 permanent and freelance staff.
He faced and overcame the perennial problems of the budding entrepreneur. "I wanted to make independent TV productions and I wanted to do it in Liverpool, 200 miles from the established broadcasting centre in London and 35 miles from the broadcasting outpost of Manchester," he says. "People said it was impossible.
"To convince Channel 4 to invest £34m in this strange Scouser in jeans and sweatshirts, who'd never had to run a company of that size or run a production of that size. I went to the Department of Trade and Industry in Manchester and talked them into giving me a regional selective assistance grant. The political impact it had in London, that a government department was willing to write a cheque, made them think we might be onto something."
In 2002 Phil and Alexis Redmond sold part of their stake for £330m to private equity group LDC in a management buyout. In 2005 LDC and the Redmonds sold out to London-based rival All3Media in a deal reported to total between £335m and £345m. Today Redmond's involvement in the company he founded is as an executive producer of Grange Hill.
His high-profile roles over the years have included positions on the Liverpool Democracy Commission five years ago and in the Department for Education and Employment's advisory group for the National Year of Reading in 1998. He was instrumental in setting up the Liverpool Film Office in 1989 and has a professorship and honorary chair of media studies at Liverpool John Moores University (LJMU).
Unsurprisingly, Redmond is a busy man. As Insider tried to find a slot in his diary, Working Lunch had become Working Afternoon Tea (catchy) and then became Working Sandwiches at the Chamber of Commerce, as the sociologist, the entrepreneur and the media mogul jostled for attention in his hectic schedule.
In his latest role, as chairman of the Merseyside Entrepreneurship Commission, Redmond is taking on the tricky subject of how to encourage and nurture entrepreneurs. He sees the commission - brought into existence by Government Office for the North West to give the Objective One team something to focus on in their final years - as "an opportunity to achieve something, rather than it becoming another talking shop".
Many an eyebrow was raised by the cynics of Merseyside as the consultation and discussion process began in April 2005. But the secret lies in Redmond's position outside of the public sector and in his experiences.
"Spending all those years working in a very politicised industry and navigating all the creative egos involved in TV and film production, those are the kind of qualities that would make any chairman," he says.
"It was not a traditional business base and I could offer a fresh eye. I thought it was interesting intellectually to look at this whole issue of entrepreneurship - is it alive and well, does it need to be reinvigorated?"
He was supported by a team of business founders drawn from the private sector that included Tony Caldeira of Knowsley-based cushion company Caldeira, Len Collinson, national chairman of the Forum of Private Business, Matt Johnson of Liverpool web design company Mando Group and Esther McVey, founder of media training company Making It.
"The key was that they were all real people, doing real jobs in the real world and not people who thought that they knew what business is all about," he says.
But now the talking is over, a glossy report has been produced and a brand created - "U can make it in Merseyside" - is anyone going to listen? The commission's recommendations include a rationalisation of the plethora of organisations and agencies designed to help entrepreneurs, a fresh look at the education curriculum - "Let's spend a bit less time on Henry VIII and his six wives and a bit more time on who Cunard was" - and the creation of a northern think tank.
"Everybody who does a report in any government or public sector work hopes something will happen, but it's outside of your control," admits Redmond. "All we can do now is ask the question: "What's next?'"
With the formal work complete and everyone from Downtown Liverpool in Business to the Learning and Skills Council to Yorkshire Bank consulted, the next step is for the public sector to offer feedback on the suggested goals.
The most called-for and yet seemingly most unrealistic request is for a single lead agency for entrepreneurial support. "It is realistic," says Redmond. "The issue everybody's got to get their head round is the timescale. If possible the timescale just flows in with the natural ending of funding regimes.
"If everybody sits down and works it out, the management of the way things are better rationalised can be achieved without too much pain. There will be some pain somewhere, but that's the nature of things."
It is this same pain that entrepreneurs must undergo as a rite of passage on the road to success; they just need a helping hand, both financial and educational, to set them on their way. "You can't teach someone to be an entrepreneur who hasn't already got the entrepreneurial spark, but you can help them enhance that spark or give them the confidence to have a go," says Redmond.
Importantly, this is not about creating a prescribed number of entrepreneurs, but rather a question of creating an environment in which a Cunard, a Pilkington or a Gates of the future may flourish.
"History shows us that at any one time there are only a handful of people that make a real difference," says Redmond. "This city's built on the Cunards, the Pilkingtons, entrepreneurs that create world-beating ideas and global businesses. That's what my ten-year vision was: to set in place a more enterprising, sympathetic and educational environment out of which six or seven people over the next ten years are going to come up with world-beating businesses."
Make way for the sociologist coming through. "Go back to the 19th century and you find the Cunards, the Pilkingtons, the Rowntrees, the Cadburys, people coming up with ideas, creating big businesses, huge structures that employ lots of people, generate lots of cash, which generates philanthropy, which brings about social intervention," he summarises effortlessly.
"Our whole education system, our health systems, our social policy systems came from the decisions of these guys to think life can be better. Today we are a social intervention society - though it comes with a bigger tax take than we've ever had before. You're only going to get those taxes from people in work, with strong successful businesses, so government realises it's got to stimulate more enterprise."
The next big Redmond project is to set up a not-for-profit digital TV station, the North West Digital Platform, initially supported by the regional development agency (RDA). Here sociologist meets entrepreneur again as the channel, while offering opportunities for new artists, will serve as a public service broadcast channel with the NHS, the police and even private companies booking time and showing films.
This channel, says Redmond, will fill a gap - the tightening of regulation has meant that gritty messages about drugs or disease, for which Brookside and Hollyoaks have been useful vehicles, are being squeezed out.
"The BBC, ITV and Channel 4 have really stepped back from the public service agenda," he says. "The regulations on drama are so tight that a lot of the campaigns we ran like STDs, violence, drugs are very difficult to do now because of taste and decency rules. As always, the biggest issue is compliance. Should that channel have the same rules as the BBC? It's not broadcast, but a social development channel."
As Redmond proudly waves the flag for the North West and Merseyside, he casts a wary eye towards the BBC's proposals to move some of its departments to Manchester. "Do they really mean it? I would prefer to have seen BBC2 or Radio4 move up as a symbol of the shift in editorial control. As the main channels are staying in London, the danger is that it's a housekeeping exercise," he says.
"I also am a bit nervous about the fact they're asking for £3600m extra cash to move and £350m from the RDA. Because no matter what the positive nature of the case for getting that £350m, it's coming away from other budgets in the North West. The BBC's already a £33.4bn public corporation - there's a bit of a social policy issue in there.
The positive side is that it's happening and it is up to all of us in the North West to get as much as we possibly can out if it."
Redmond is not one of those entrepreneurs who sells his business and sails off to Marbella with a few million. His exit has allowed him to tackle yet more issues and create yet more ventures as he strives to effect change in the social, media and business framework in which we all operate.